What are you doing if a spectator reveals a sleight?

[erenso]

I think this thread isn't about hecklers. It is about having not enough practiced to perform a trick. First think about a cheat do you think a cheat ever missed a false deal false shuffle or anything else???

Ok this means practicing, practicing and practicing.

If you need a perfect faro shuffle(one), you should be able to do it 10 times in a row without any mistake. I juggle with burning torches this means I perform with three torches, but if I am on training I use four.

If your double lift isn't ok, there are hundred of self working tricks. I hear in forums I do a great pass and so on, most didn't practice with mirrors. They didn't see there pass could be easy detect by a small kid (angle from above), from the left for example. I perform standing and surrounded this means no pass. If we would meet at a gambling table I have no trouble with a pass.

Watch the performance of older magicians which are paid for there performance. Most of the tricks are easy to do, if you have practiced enough and memorized it right. But be aware even Michael Ammar explains tricks which don't work "right" in the real world. For example if you transform a 1$ bill in a 100$ bill, you should be aware your spectator will try to grab "his" 100$ bill and go away. (this will happen in 3 from 10 cases) Think what you are doing and what reaction you will get.

erenso

[Kirbynator]

i would quick stop the routine/trick whatever and blow his head away with a new mega slight. Then maybe he has more respect and doesnt say it to the other spectators

[sarmad]

no i agree with cardaddict, cause thts a gud way to tell them tht ur invited to see it unless u want to enjoy it, or u can be politer depeneding on who u r

[al3h@nDr0]

another thing one could do is to ask the guy to do his tricks which will of course be worse for the simple reason he doesnt have a mind to think this isn't right and reveals everything.So at the time he is performing u will try and make him look rediculous by revealing his cheap secrets

[Epiphany]

Originally Posted by erenso

I think this thread isn't about hecklers. It is about having not enough practiced to perform a trick. First think about a cheat do you think a cheat ever missed a false deal false shuffle or anything else???

Ok this means practicing, practicing and practicing.

If you need a perfect faro shuffle(one), you should be able to do it 10 times in a row without any mistake. I juggle with burning torches this means I perform with three torches, but if I am on training I use four.

If your double lift isn't ok, there are hundred of self working tricks. I hear in forums I do a great pass and so on, most didn't practice with mirrors. They didn't see there pass could be easy detect by a small kid (angle from above), from the left for example. I perform standing and surrounded this means no pass. If we would meet at a gambling table I have no trouble with a pass.

Watch the performance of older magicians which are paid for there performance. Most of the tricks are easy to do, if you have practiced enough and memorized it right. But be aware even Michael Ammar explains tricks which don't work "right" in the real world. For example if you transform a 1$ bill in a 100$ bill, you should be aware your spectator will try to grab "his" 100$ bill and go away. (this will happen in 3 from 10 cases) Think what you are doing and what reaction you will get.

erenso

Well, I don't think we're really talking about people who do the moves poorly, but rather when you're performing for someone who already knew how the trick was done, so after the effect he reveals it. Maybe some guy who bought a magic book when he was ten, didn't have the patience to actually learn how to do it, but still knows how to do it. But good advice nonetheless.

I've run into this a lot, and this is my little order:

1. Prove him wrong
2. (If 1 not possible) Do a trick that he can't possibly know
3. (after number 2) Walk away - if the others were enjoying your magic, they will get annoyed with the idiot heckler.

You'd be surprised how easy it is to convince spectators that what the heckler is explaining is bullshit, even if he's right. For example, one time I performed the Invisible Deck. One guy yells out that he knows how it's done, and he starts explaining and making a huge fuss about it. EVERYONE looks over at him, and he starts to explain the whole evens/odds, add up to thirteen, hearts-spades thing. While the crowd is looking at him, I just very casually switch out the invisible deck for a regular deck in my pocket. Then one of the guys was like "wait, how does it work?". Another spectator says "he says the cards are glued together *laughs*". So the heckler, enraged that nobody believes him, takes the deck from my hand to 'prove it'... man did he ever look like an idiot.

[S.U.B-Xero]

If he reveals a sleight , then summon a ghost and tell REVEAL THIS , LOL .

[Dark Magix]

Originally Posted by Epiphany

Well, I don't think we're really talking about people who do the moves poorly, but rather when you're performing for someone who already knew how the trick was done, so after the effect he reveals it. Maybe some guy who bought a magic book when he was ten, didn't have the patience to actually learn how to do it, but still knows how to do it. But good advice nonetheless.

I've run into this a lot, and this is my little order:

1. Prove him wrong
2. (If 1 not possible) Do a trick that he can't possibly know
3. (after number 2) Walk away - if the others were enjoying your magic, they will get annoyed with the idiot heckler.

You'd be surprised how easy it is to convince spectators that what the heckler is explaining is bullshit, even if he's right. For example, one time I performed the Invisible Deck. One guy yells out that he knows how it's done, and he starts explaining and making a huge fuss about it. EVERYONE looks over at him, and he starts to explain the whole evens/odds, add up to thirteen, hearts-spades thing. While the crowd is looking at him, I just very casually switch out the invisible deck for a regular deck in my pocket. Then one of the guys was like "wait, how does it work?". Another spectator says "he says the cards are glued together *laughs*". So the heckler, enraged that nobody believes him, takes the deck from my hand to 'prove it'... man did he ever look like an idiot.

That's a very cool thing to do =]

[CrazyMobster]

What I have done and it has worked for me is to say something like "Oh, here you want to show everyone? Ok then.." and continue.

[shattering]

If the one who reveal the tricks is one of my audience, I usually leave the place, because it's not worthed anymore. The don't want the fun of magic, they just want to look great by saying "I know this" or "oh, that's just a bla bla bla". I hate 'em.

If the one who reveal the tricks is someone from outside (say like, someone came when I was performing ), then I usually just ignore them and say something like "Shut up!". Usually the audience will help you by saying something like "Yea, let him do the magic" or something like that.

If any of those doesn't works and the heckler keeps following you then just punch him in the face or kick him or whatever. And let him(or her, but this's never happens) go to hell.

[r33box]

Originally Posted by shattering

If the one who reveal the tricks is one of my audience, I usually leave the place, because it's not worthed anymore. The don't want the fun of magic, they just want to look great by saying "I know this" or "oh, that's just a bla bla bla". I hate 'em.

If the one who reveal the tricks is someone from outside (say like, someone came when I was performing ), then I usually just ignore them and say something like "Shut up!". Usually the audience will help you by saying something like "Yea, let him do the magic" or something like that.

If any of those doesn't works and the heckler keeps following you then just punch him in the face or kick him or whatever. And let him(or her, but this's never happens) go to hell.

Dude...Im 200% AGREED with u bro....Usually i juz leave the place.....

[drmad]

ok but i dont have many moves to show......

[lllusionist]

Just swallow it with a smile. Say something nice to everyone else, and pickpocket the heckler. Continue with the performance... the next time he does something annoyingly stupid, look right at him. Look a little annoyed. Just stare at him for awhile... smirk and breath out loudly. 'Right I think I'm done performing'. Everyone will protest and turn against him. They'll want you to continue if you were any good. Smile and say 'Haha ok I'd be happy to.' Look right at him. 'And try to behave =)' And return his wallet. This will make him feel completely stupid. You have to do it all with a smile though... you don't want to come across as a show-off that is desperate to perform. my two cents. You don't want to just leave... then the loser would have won! Pop the morons ego haha. Then steal his girlfriend or something =P.

[meir]

make a routine of it like brian tudor did like at the end of tivo 2.0go into ambitious card and always be one step ahead of him and a tip transpozitionings by dan and dave and hedbergs peak is the #1 heckler buster

[MagicJohnson]

I just keep going and ignore them and if you dont pay them any attention the rest of the specs wont either

[mindslur]

I dont have a definite answer for this but here's what I thought up to now...

First Exo was right in saying : "I found that the best solution in a restaurant situation is to distance yourself from the heckler."

Second, I've noticed that people who know me tend to be more open and saying more and revealing more... My friends or people who knew me a little were generally harder public than strangers.

I prefer to avoid ego fights as much as possible. If they are inevitable there are two options. Retreat or utter defeat the enemy. That nice pickpocketing method and the very devious deck switch after the use of the invisible deck are great examples of utter defetats. Priceless.

Anecdote again : I finished my first stand-up show this month and all my tricks were perfectly performed in the sense noone knew how it was done and everyone enjoyed them. I came about to do some card tricks to people in the audience after the show. Some guy who says he's a magician starts revealing how tricks are done to some people around us. He thought he knew a lot about magic because he knew the color monte. At some point he said, "You are just able to keep cards stuck together" (which was wrong because it was far more than that but it would be ridiculous to tell the guy more!) So here's what I said... "You might know how to do a trick or two but do you know magic?"

I only did a chicago openner followed by a small ambitious card routine and he was blown away. I then said to him. "I know you know some moves but you cant call yourself a magician if you destroy the magic in the mind of people." If its not what I said its pretty close... I said that to him when I was 1 on 1. I think I'll always remember the look on his face, his total amazement and shock as I performed those two mints of magic. Primo, He lived a magic moment... Secundo, he understood how special and precious it was. Tertio, i showed him he shouldn't destroy that for others. .

Thus said I counsel that if you see someone sceptical you dont have to start prooving your methods. I think that would be exhausting and counterproductive... If you start to get into some sort of competition of "you didnt see how i did that did you?" then it never ends and you will always feel bad vibe and big pressure. Sadly in party situations where you are there just for fun that cant be helped much. Also... the more tricks you do the more people will be burnining you and... so you know... thats one among many reasons why restaurant workers only do several tricks.

Its not my style to insult or make a person feel bad. Even if I have the group on my side. Most of the time its not much a question of rivalery. The person wants to show he knows something, or thinks he knows something. One thing here : if a spectator thinks he knows how a trick is done the magic is gone for them... even if they are wrong... because they are now in the rational state of mind... They are trying to find the trick instead of feeling the magic.

Best thing and maybe the hardest thing which starts right at the begining and goes on even after the tricks are done... yes even after all your props are away and you are only talking to people you are still going to get some questions about what you just did. Don't start giving reasons, even fake ones. You don't need to lie. I don't want to lie! I want to make relationships and people to trust me.

If you are able to open with a trick that makes sense and that totally mystifies everybody then you are in. Otherwise you might have someone harder on you that reveals what you did or tries to guess. I have a great example. I was at my friends house. I was just with him noone else and I started showing him some magic. I did a great effect which astonished many people but my mistake is I showed him too much magic in one shot... he simply couldn't take any more and was just jumping to any possible plausible explaination as they poped in his head and said them out loud while I was doing the effects. Lets just say this. The effect was that I had a deck of cards... The person said stop and even handled the cards and chose where four business cards were inserted. At the end the places where the spectator stoped were uhoh... not the four aces.... there was the ace of clubs, and 3 other cards. But at the back of the business cards were the name of those cards... and a fifth busines card had nothing as prediction on the back. Why? thats because the remainder of the deck is blank!

Now that trick I did to about 20 people. To my friend that night he simply said at the end you HAD to have switched the deck. I couldn't argue with that... I did at the time. Truth is I didn't switch anything... He was convinced that I had to switch decks to make this effect work. One thing I notice wheter it be a magician or a laymen, there's always different possible ways to make have an effect occur... Sometimes they correspond to the way they were actually done but...

So... maybe its not the best way but if someone tells me ..." you did X!" I won't say "No I didn't!"

I might say as if I was talking to a child : "Oh! Thank you for your participation!!!"

I might add : "Now let the others have a little fun also!"

Variable ambiguity in the response...
Specatator : "You did it"
Spectator : "You did something!"
Spectator : "You changed the card" (This statement is still ambiguous)
Spectator : "You did a top change!"
Spectator : "You did a simon multiple top change!" (Super precise)

Something is funny just then... The most precise explaination is only understandable by a magician. The most abiguous response would need a discussion to solve because the spectator doesnt even know what he's saying. The ones in the middle are the most understandable by laymen.

Often if I get caught or think I get caught its concerning something common that people already knew existed (double lift, shuffle control). In the case of a shuffle I do an infinity crimp and ask the spectator to cut the cards.

Funny thing is most of the time people think I do a double lift but I don't. Damn people are suspicious... Well they were before... Now I try to make them in a non suspicious manner.

Unless your a pro and you're always talking or interacting without leaving space for divagations you will get remarks. Notice how Bill Malone leaves place for interation but is always in TOTAL control! It amazes me... He's even a little rough but thats part of his charm also.

You will get far fewer derogatory remarks if :
You diversify your methods and attempt to have routines which do not use the same principles.
For example : do not only rely on double lifts for your ambitious card routine .
You do not force over and over the same card to a person from the begining. (You are making the person look like a fool... maybe)
You must take the time to introduce and have a rapport before you begin doing magic. (Other schools will say you can introduce yourself with a piece of magic also)
Have your magic presented as a gift from you to them, as an entertainment. Also, if you can find a piece of magic that involves giving a souvenir or a gift to a spectator.
Eye contact is very important : it helps in at least three ways... 1)It creates a rapport. 2)You don't look like you are doing something fishy 3) People who are looking at your eyes are not looking at the cards/hands/coins.

Speech is very impfortant : 1)It creates a rapport. 2)You seem in conrol and social... 3)If you were silent even for a very short amount of time they might think THATS when he's doing something fishy. Damnit people, if you are doing a PASS talk at the same time. (And Damn myself... I need to work on that also...)
In other words : silence bad (except when the magic is about to happen and you are already "ahaid") talk good... breaking in a discussion bad...
Quote from bill malone "David, quiet, lets not break into a discussion here."


So these were a few WHAT TO...
Now HOW :
-Script your routines but dont make it seem like a script present it in a FORMAL yet CONVERSATIONAL tone.
-Always have a few circumstantial jokes at hand to fill in silences.

You have to eliminate suspicion at the source. The source is time to think. Don't give too much leeway. Sorry to compare spectators to dogs but thats the analogy I had at the moment in my head. Presenting magic is like walking a dog.



Best is to avoid being in such situations.
First is to set the stage, this prevents rationalisation and skeptical comments.
Second is to leave the stage early if necessary. Don't loose your energy entertaining people who dont want to be entertained . (Dont take it too personal at the moment but always think how to ameliorate your presentation and entertainment value...)

I talked a lot about how to avoid explainatory remarks. But they do occur sometimes. What to do then. Ignore them but dont ignore them with a silence. Silence would be to agnowledge that there is a problem and some truth to what the spectator said. If I'm on a 1 on 1 situation it is different than if there's a group. If there's only that person and he's starting to get skeptical/nosy/rational I'll stop quickly. If there are other people I don't think it would be fair for them if I stopped, but I will if the person is insistant. Go on as if nothing has been said without freeze or hesitation. Or else proceed with other methods mentionned below.

Here are some things that I say depending on the situation : "Interesting hypothesis. I guess some cheaters could do it that way but I'm a magician."

If the person is drunk and he says : you picked up two cards. I just might first proove wrong and laugh and say "You have been drinking too much sir you see two where there's only one!"

If a spectator says : "Oh you're just good at hiding cards" I just might use that to my advantage and open in a routine similar to what is in david stone's restaurant magic where the deck is compressed to become only 4 cards. I end saying to the exposer "And he was right I'm good at hiding cards, I just hide cards in cards".

IF a spectator says : "you just made me take that card" I say : "I'm sorry you feel that way, here take any other card you want I will even turn my back" I turn around and say "Is that fair" They will have to say yes. (this means I may have to change trick and go into another routine, noone will know except me)

Same statement "you made me take that card" but after a revealed prediction... at the end of the trick... what to do... outch... maybe I should work on the presentation (see eugene burger) I think that what is really important is to prevent this from being said. How? Easy... make sure that everyone in the group feels that the selection was fair. Ask the participant if they feel it is fair. Even go as far as saying if they want another card. (After the second trick they wont care... Make them shuffle the cards, make them change their mind and all till they get tired of handling the cards... after that they will think it doesnt change a thing... that the magician will make the miracle even if we try to mess with him... so by the time you're in your 2nd,3rd 4th trick you will get no such interruptions or accusations)

So If they accuse your prediction card to be forced one option could be, if you have an invisible deck to TOP and finish with the invisible deck as ultimate prediction.

Im thinking of other possible accusations or explainations. If the explaination seems really weird you can laugh and look in the eyes of other spectators. My little cousin actually was right and he did see a part of my invisible loop. Everyone else was amaze but you know how people at 8-12 years old try to know WHY? on everything... Well I just laughed and looked at others. Others said : thats impossible. I said... "Right! Hehe. Alex you're seeing things that arent there... I'd maybe better stop doing magic before you go crazy "

The thing I hate the most is getting caught when I'm palming a card... Thats why I'm so hesitant at palming.... I've been caught way too many times but then again I stop talking when I'm palming I need to act more natural... Its hard work and I need to act fluidly.

Worst case scenario :
Ok im imagining possible solutions....
You are palming a card and you need that card for your reveal in about a minute for a card to wallet/pocket. Someone screams.. "He has a card hidden in his hand!"
what to do what to do... (Please tell me your answers if you have any im just going to imagine possible solutions here)

Solution 1 : Go with the flow actually show you had a card palmed. Say, "Its always a possibility for me to get caught... Now that you caught me I guess I have no choice than to tell you why I wanted to take that card secretly. I guess I have no choice than to do it faster this time so you don't notice it when I put the card in my pocket" As I say that I have shown only the back of the palmed card... doing a double lift showing an indifferent card from the face of the deck... I keep the cards as one in my hand casually gesturing and as I say "When I put the card in my pocket" I ditch the unseen initially palmed card in my pocket and come out with the card face up going out as if nothing had happened... I continue talking all the while saying "So watch closely because I will try to make your card (point to the deck) go to my pocket". point with an empty hand to the pocket. *** magical gesture, tent vanish or your favorite card vanish..., invisible palm patter*** Say, "Its done" reveal the card has quickly but surely travelled to your pocket, invisibly. (And the referree at third base says "SAFE!".)

Solution 2: Display the card that was palmed, as if it was never meant to be hidden... Say, as if the card wasnt trying to be hidden but was just in the hand... "So I will attempt to..." Vanish it and make it appear in pocket using your favorite method. For example... look at mambo number 5 with oz pearlman on penguin magic.


Solution 3 : Change trick! With all the heat on the revealed/hidden palmed card you could "hide an elephant" as Gary Darwin said. Turn sideways and try to deny it... Ditch the whole deck except 1 card in the left coat/pants pocket... Hold the single card as if it were a whole deck. Pretend to put the card back in the deck. Slam the cards together and hold them twirling them and displaying as a single card. the deck has vanished. Pretty good I might say.

Anti-solution 4 : Use your favorite card throwing technique to slam the palmed card in the nosy spectator's eye or mouth. Proceed by saying "Shut up you twat!"

Anti-solution 5 : Scream and run away.

Anti-solution 6 : Freeze and say nothing.

Anti-solution 7 : Cry.

Solution 8 : Actually get caught on purpose with right hand... Freeze and say nothing... say no with your head... Cough... cough.. spit out card from mouth. Haha gotcha.


The thing I dont like is when people try to explain to me how I vanished a card as i backpalmed... generally people show me a card clipped between the middle and ring finger by one corner... they always do that if they are to guess. So now I use the backpalm in far more subtle ways.

The other thing I hate is people noticing I have cards on my lap... One thing that could be said is "Oh thanks" and just gather the cards.

Worst of all I HATE when someone who is a beginner in magic exposes while I do magic. Exposure is not as much a hassle than a magician saying what you are doing WHILE you are doing it. Its immature and inconsiderate... How dare he calls himself a magician if he's ruining the magic for everyone? (To the difference, magic exposure is a fact but it doesnt happen durring the moment a magic routine is performed... it can be pleasing for an audience to know a small secret or what seems like the secret... www.mallusionist.com)

All in all there is much more to be said on this subject. Without having some sort of copyright I reserve certain intellectual property to what I have said here. You can freely use what I say but you may not publish without prior approval any of this text. Bla bla bla.

Good day
mindslur.